Advice on moving forward with Microdiscectomy

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sol1234
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December 17, 2019 at 9:40 am

Post count: 8

#31714

Hello Dr. Corenman – Thank you so much for this service. 32 y/o Male. Herniated discs at l4/l5 and l5/s1. Very active typically. The former being the culprit here, the second less severe. It’s been re-agitating a couple times a year for the past 2-3 years. Symptoms – chronic lower back pain that I function with but takes away from my physical activities immensely. I have some sciatic pain in my hips and buttocks, and a few weeks ago had tingling in feet and then testicles (which has now subsided – at first was afraid of cuada equina syndrome, but no other symptoms for that). Sciatic pain is not nearly as painful as lower back pain, and seldom goes all down my leg.

Met with my neurosurgeon yesterday, and he won’t recommend a path of treatment, but said he would perform a microdiscectomy if that’s the path I wanted to go. I prodded him “what would he do?” and he wouldn’t play ball. While it would take care of the sciatica symptoms, he believes the lower back pain would still be there (though said there’s a chance it could improve). My concern is potential cuada equina, or permanent nerve damage if I don’t get the surgery done. Also, winter is slower for me and I could afford to be recovering work-wise in these months.

I’ve been having these symptoms for 3 years now, just confirmed the herniations / DDD / moderate to severe spinal stenosis a month ago.

Microdiscectomy scheduled for a few weeks from now, but I’m having big second doubts if it won’t address the back pain. Any advice? At the end of the day don’t I need to get that disc fragment removed? So it stops pushing on my nerves and spinal cord?

MRI picture of herniation: https://i.imgur.com/68usOJvl.jpg

Donald Corenman, MD, DC
Moderator

December 20, 2019 at 7:43 am

Post count: 8660

#31747

I would agree with your neurosurgeon regarding the potential for symptom relief. Microdiscectomies work well for nerve pain relief (buttocks and leg pain from nerve root compression) but don’t work as well for lower back pain (LBP). This does not mean they are totally ineffective for relief of back pain but the results are much less consistent regarding LBP. If you don’t have motor weakness and the symptoms are tolerable, you could continue to manage your disc disorder without surgery. If you find the buttocks and leg symptoms not tolerable, consider the decompression surgery. There is, in addition, a 50-60% chance of some back pain relief.

Dr. Corenman

PLEASE REMEMBER, THIS FORUM IS MEANT TO PROVIDE GENERAL INFORMATION ON SPINE ANATOMY, CONDITIONS AND TREATMENTS. TO GET AN ACCURATE DIAGNOSIS, YOU MUST VISIT A QUALIFIED PROFESSIONAL IN PERSON.

Donald Corenman, MD, DC is a highly-regarded spine surgeon, considered an expert in the area of neck and back pain. Trained as both a Medical Doctor and Doctor of Chiropractic, Dr. Corenman earned academic appointments as Clinical Assistant Professor and Assistant Professor of Orthopaedic Surgery at the University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, and his research on spine surgery and rehabilitation has resulted in the publication of multiple peer-reviewed articles and two books.

sol1234
Participant

December 20, 2019 at 8:49 am

Post count: 8

#31749

Dr. Corenman, thank you for the reply. The information is incredibly valuable. Sorry to follow up again, but the decision is made a little harder just based on these flare-ups happening a couple times a year, and lasting about two months. With limited knowledge you have on my case, and the MRI image, do you think there is a significant chance I’m contributing to permanent nerve damage by having the disc compressing the nerve roots so much? Since this is clearly not something that is going to go away on its own, would you think it’s possible to live a life with that much compression, or is it something that is likely going to have to be removed in the future? Thank you again, as I’m sure you know in the patients you see that back issues cause tremendous worry; you are doing all of us a great service.

Donald Corenman, MD, DC
Moderator

December 20, 2019 at 10:14 am

Post count: 8660

#31753

I can’t open the images as this site does not support unknown hyperlinks.

If you do not have muscle strength deficit due to nerve root compression, there is no rush to surgery. There are some studies indicating that successful surgery in your position has better results if symptoms have been present less than six months prior to surgery but in reality, there is probably no pressing issue for surgery.The question in your case for surgery or not is really how impaired you feel with these episodes lasting 1/3 of the year (“flare-ups happening a couple times a year, and lasting about two months”). Also, if the diagnosis is correct (something that needs a work-up hopefully performed correctly) and whether the surgery is appropriate for the disorder you have.

Dr. Corenman

PLEASE REMEMBER, THIS FORUM IS MEANT TO PROVIDE GENERAL INFORMATION ON SPINE ANATOMY, CONDITIONS AND TREATMENTS. TO GET AN ACCURATE DIAGNOSIS, YOU MUST VISIT A QUALIFIED PROFESSIONAL IN PERSON.

Donald Corenman, MD, DC is a highly-regarded spine surgeon, considered an expert in the area of neck and back pain. Trained as both a Medical Doctor and Doctor of Chiropractic, Dr. Corenman earned academic appointments as Clinical Assistant Professor and Assistant Professor of Orthopaedic Surgery at the University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, and his research on spine surgery and rehabilitation has resulted in the publication of multiple peer-reviewed articles and two books.

sol1234
Participant

December 20, 2019 at 11:31 am

Post count: 8

#31756

I’ll try one more time to attach the image below:

And the direct link from a reputable host source: http://silvercometawa.org/mri.jpg

If that doesn’t work, thank you again, you’ve been more than helpful! Have a great day!

Donald Corenman, MD, DC
Moderator

December 21, 2019 at 2:11 pm

Post count: 8660

#31763

The images come through however the sagittal (side view) image shows a good-sized herniation but the axial images (bottom-up) are of a normal level below the herniation.

Dr. Corenman

PLEASE REMEMBER, THIS FORUM IS MEANT TO PROVIDE GENERAL INFORMATION ON SPINE ANATOMY, CONDITIONS AND TREATMENTS. TO GET AN ACCURATE DIAGNOSIS, YOU MUST VISIT A QUALIFIED PROFESSIONAL IN PERSON.

Donald Corenman, MD, DC is a highly-regarded spine surgeon, considered an expert in the area of neck and back pain. Trained as both a Medical Doctor and Doctor of Chiropractic, Dr. Corenman earned academic appointments as Clinical Assistant Professor and Assistant Professor of Orthopaedic Surgery at the University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, and his research on spine surgery and rehabilitation has resulted in the publication of multiple peer-reviewed articles and two books.
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Donald Corenman, MD, DC

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81 reviews

Eric S

Sep 26, 2021

by Eric S on Donald Corenman, MD, DC

Successful pars repair at 46 years old

Back in November of 2018 (at 46 years old) I came from Vancouver BC to have a pars repair done with Dr. Donald Corenman at the Steadman Clinic in Vail Colorado. I'm finally posting this review nearly three years later in late 2021. The reason I waited so long was I wanted to know the final result before I posted my review. Unfortunately in that time Dr. Corenman has retired. Nevertheless, I want to post this review of Dr. Corenman and his staff at the Steadman Clinic in their excellent treatment of my L5 pars interarticularis.

I fractured my pars at age 42 back in 2014 when rolling on the gym floor, and was denied treatment by the Canadian healthcare system, probably due to my age. First my GP told me there was no surgical option for a pars defect, which was quite incorrect! I tried to live with it, but the symptoms worsened (periodic random spine slippage and weeks of resultant pain after just bending over to tie my shoe, so I eventually learned to mostly squat and hardly bend). When I finally consulted with Canadian spine surgeons, I was told they believed my pars defect had been congenital (since birth). This was absurd, considering I had done extreme martial arts (including jiu jitsu) for years prior, as well as 5 years of reinforcing steel full time in my 20s, probably the hardest job on the back you can find. No pars defect like mine would possibly have allowed this--ergo it was impossible that I had had the defect since birth. I did however have an asymptomatic congenital spina bifida occulta that made me more susceptible to a pars fracture. In 2014 in one instant, I went from having the strongest back people I knew said they'd ever seen, to being unable to safely bend over and tie my shoe without a non-negligible risk of my spine slipping randomly (which would lead to weeks of pain after each occurrence). This was due to the unilateral L5 pars defect, otherwise known as spondylolysis. It was when lying in pain on the floor 4 years later after maybe the 6th spine slippage event post injury, that I had had enough, and resolved to have surgery. If Canada's "universal health care" said no, I would make lemonade from lemons, and find the very best surgeon in the world at pars repairs. That was Dr. Donald Corenman. Dr. Corenman back in 2018 ran a website https://neckandback.com/ that dedicated many pages to the science of every aspect of pars repairs, from eligibility (good discs on MRI), to best surgical techniques (minimal open compared to minimally invasive), best imaging to use (i.e., O-Arm with Stealth imaging vs. older fluoroscopy), the ideal amount of BMP to use and why not use too much or too little, and much more, all to do with pars repairs, pages upon pages of his site just on the pars, with scientific references and his own extensive expert opinion. As a health research statistician, I was very impressed with this. It was in stark contrast to the websites of other spine surgeons which barely gave the pars a word or two, focusing almost exclusively on fusions. I had found the best surgeon in the world for pars repairs, and so after Dr. Corenman personally screened my MRI to ensure my discs were healthy, I booked the surgery.

Being 46 years old at the time of surgery in 2018, with a 4-year-old pars fracture from 2014 combined with a congenital SBO meant my pars fragment was somewhat atrophied, but it was "very solid", said Dr. Corenman in the operative report. Nevertheless, it was challenging with two things to fix, the pars and SBO, and OR time was around 4 hours. Recovery over the following months was guided by a very clear "Spine binder" from the Steadman Clinic with strict rules of "no BLT" (no bending, lifting or twisting), and illustrated physiotherapy guidelines. They even warned patients to avoid fish oil supplements, which could excessively dampen inflammation and hence slow bone healing. They answered many questions I had during months of recovery, with responses coming from the very supportive Lori Fugate (then director of Dr. Corenman's practice), and Ehrich Bean (then physician's assistant at the practice), as well as a couple calls with Dr. Corenman himself after two of the CT scans. Ehrich Bean offered great advice for taking the spine binder conservatively due to the nature of pars repairs vs. fusions. The final post-op CT scan I had was a couple weeks ago at 34 months post-op, and Dr. Corenman had retired, but I got a very positive and informative call from Eric Strauch (current PA at the Steadman Clinic under Dr. Corenman's replacement there, and who had also worked with Dr. Corenman previously). The staff at the Steadman Clinic were extremely supportive all the way through the process. I should mention, the local Canadian spine surgeon did offer me very good post-operative support including antibiotics as needed to deal with a mild surface incision-site infection early on, booking numerous x-rays when I felt something was amiss, as well as booking all four of my post-op CT scans. I am very grateful for that support also.

My final result shows plenty of solid bone across the pars and a healed SBO, with my vertebral body now a solid bone ring instead of being broken at two places as it was pre-op. Does my spine hold up in the real world? You bet! I have recently dug and moved several yards of dirt and sand and gravel by myself (shovel and wheelbarrow!) to fix our water main, pulled roots from the yard, moved several "portable" (these are HUGE) air conditioners up several flights of stairs my myself, and lifted weights. I now run 2 miles (3.2 KM) several times weekly with a hard 100 meter dash in the middle. I bend deeply before each run I go on, with no spine slippage. My spine feels amazing. I can bend over to do exercise, or real word tasks, with no risk of spine slippage.

My sincere thanks to God, Dr. Donald Corenman, Lori Fugate, Ehrich Bean, Eric Strauch, and the Steadman Clinic, as well as the Canadian spine surgeon who offered me excellent post-operative care back in Canada. You have all given me a new lease on life.

Sincerely,
Eric S

Robert S

May 11, 2021

by Robert S on Donald Corenman, MD, DC

Back Fusion Surgery

I had my entire lumbar spine fused in November of 2018. I had scoliosis , with pinched nerves that were so painful I could hardly walk - and standing for more than a few minutes was impossible. Even sitting was painful.
The fusion surgery produced immediate relief! And the recovery was much easier than I expected.
To this day I can do all the activities I love from hiking, to standing in a stream fly fishing to riding my bike long distances - or just walking down the street with my wife.
Kudos to Dr. Corenman and his staff, (including the two Erics) for taking such good care of me!

Leslie R

Jul 9, 2020

by Leslie R on Donald Corenman, MD, DC

TLIF

I had my TLIF surgery on 6/24/2020 by Dr. Corenman, I can not say enough good things about the Dr or his staff. I was always treated with respect and explained everything throughly, that made it easy for everyone to understand. I highly recommend Dr. Corenman and the Steadman Clinic.

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